Hello and welcome back to Freight Up, the number 1 commodities and freight markets podcast from FIS.
We're your hosts, Jess, and Davide, and in this episode of Freight Up and in this episode, we’re joined by Ben Klang, who breaks down the latest trends in the dry freight market, Hao Pei discussing the rebound in iron ore prices, and Archie Smith providing an update on the decline in Brent crude futures.
Additionally, we have Hugh Taylor from FIS, sharing his expertise on risk management in shipping post a successful seminar in Athens.
Whether you're a current client or someone who's thinking of working with us, this episode's packed with essential information to keep you informed on the critical movements within the trading sphere.
Listen in as we explore these topics and more on Freight Up!
Remember, follow "Freight Up" in your favourite podcast app, and find us on LinkedIn!
And check out our app FIS Live for the latest insights.
Thanks in advance for listening to this Freight and Commodity podcast by FIS!
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Timestamps
00:00 Market updates: iron ore and dry freight.
03:23 May and June market rates fluctuated but closed higher.
07:27 Iron ore fell as expected, market analyzes.
10:25 Decrease in war premium affects oil prices.
13:41 Assist Greek shipping clients with trading derivatives.
17:54 Greek generation interested in shipping options, future plans.
This week on Freight up, we take a look at the latest movements in the
Speaker:freight markets with our Copenhagen resident Ben Klang. And we look at the
Speaker:reasons of the rebound in iron ore prices of last week with Hao
Speaker:Pei from our Shanghai office. Archie Smith will tell us more about the
Speaker:recent fall in Brent crude futures, and a special guest, Hugh Taylor from
Speaker:our London consultancy. All this and more on Freight up. Freight
Speaker:up. Hello
Speaker:and welcome back to Freight up. My name is Jess. And I'm Davide, and on
Speaker:this episode we'll be your hosts as we navigate the seas of freight and commodities
Speaker:this week. We are joined by our usual guests, Ben, Archie and Hal, as
Speaker:we review our main markets of dry freight, oil and iron ore, as
Speaker:well as a guest appearance by Hugh Taylor, the manager of the consultancy here at
Speaker:FIS. But before we get the market specific
Speaker:updates, we should have a look at the latest news and the index
Speaker:movements since our latest episode.
Speaker:What has been the broad market movements of the last two weeks?
Speaker:Let's take a quick look at this week's numbers. So
Speaker:the iron ore index has slowed back more of the territory
Speaker:it has lost over the past few months. The
Speaker:62% index has crept up from
Speaker:133 $65.02 weeks ago
Speaker:to 118 $75. More on that later
Speaker:from our Shanghai analyst, Hao Pei. The dry freight market has been
Speaker:a tale of two halves. On the one side, there's been the smaller ships with
Speaker:the handy seven TC and supermax indexes,
Speaker:basically non movers, week on week for the last two
Speaker:weeks, the former at around $30,000 and the latter at around
Speaker:16,000. The Panamax five TC index had a bit
Speaker:more movement, ranging from 15,000 to 17 and a
Speaker:half $1,000. But by far the big one has been a week
Speaker:on week move of 54% in the Cape
Speaker:five TC index. On the fuel oil front, the high
Speaker:sulfur fuel has popped back above $500 a
Speaker:tonne, closing yesterday with single five dropping
Speaker:down towards $600, along with falling crude prices, which
Speaker:have come down from $90 a month ago to $82
Speaker:today. Let's
Speaker:get a bit more detail on what we have seen in the drive freight market
Speaker:from Ben Klang. Ben, thanks for joining us. Once again, we're
Speaker:talking about some serious moves in the Capes, aren't we? Yeah, exactly. I
Speaker:mean, one group, I don't envy other Cape FFA traders at the
Speaker:moment. Again, we've seen some good moves in that market
Speaker:with less pronounced move on the other ship sizes. If you look at the
Speaker:Cape market last week, we saw most of the April losses
Speaker:were recuperated over the past week. This was
Speaker:driven particularly by the North Atlantic with
Speaker:increased cargo inquiries and Titonis list which
Speaker:has driven much stronger fixture levels. This impressive growth in
Speaker:the Capes has driven forward growth in other markets too. While
Speaker:things kick off to a slow start of the week, we got some market
Speaker:support which pushed May and June trading up to
Speaker:24 and a quarter and 28 and a quarter on
Speaker:Tuesday respectively. Despite the labour holiday on Monday
Speaker:and the low volumes, we continue to see positive moves in the
Speaker:markets, especially on Thursday due to lower lesser vessel
Speaker:supply. This helped push May and June up to
Speaker:26, 750 and 30 and a half by the end of the
Speaker:week to then see may close last night
Speaker:at 750 and June closing at
Speaker:32. Three seven five if you're looking at the Panamax,
Speaker:market rates were a bit of a mixed bag,
Speaker:fluctuating between positive momentum to range bound
Speaker:trading. Physically speaking, tonnish count rates
Speaker:held steady and there was limited transatlantic and
Speaker:frontal fixtures. Though the week started slowly and the labour
Speaker:holidays significantly impacted liquidity, there was still a lot
Speaker:of optimism, with Thursday's rate seeing May and
Speaker:June trading up to 16 450 and
Speaker:17,000 respectively. To then see may close
Speaker:last night at 1735 and June
Speaker:closed at 1795 last
Speaker:night the supermax had some
Speaker:potential towards the beginning of the week, with a focus
Speaker:on the near dated contracts following the movements of the
Speaker:larger sizes. This gradually declined as the week
Speaker:continued and by Thursday the supras did not
Speaker:follow the notable upturn of the other FFA
Speaker:market, perhaps due to weak cargo order
Speaker:volumes. However, the dated flow supported and
Speaker:slightly higher than the previous one. This sentiment continued
Speaker:throughout the week with comparatively lower interest than
Speaker:the other markets. FFA wise. May and June
Speaker:contracts ended the week just over the
Speaker:16,000 mark and Q four at 14
Speaker:600. Thanks for talking us through
Speaker:those rates. What are we looking at this week volume wise? Rather active
Speaker:week for the ffas last week despite the holidays,
Speaker:with trading volumes of around
Speaker:51,230 lots posted on the
Speaker:exchanges. On average, Cape and Panamax futures
Speaker:traded around 4600 lots and
Speaker:3430 lots per day last week.
Speaker:Super access had a less active week with the average of
Speaker:880 lots traded daily last week. On the
Speaker:option side, the main action was also on the
Speaker:capes, with 3320 lots
Speaker:being cleared on the Cape and 5090
Speaker:days on the Panama axis. Open interest decreased
Speaker:as April and Q two come to expire.
Speaker:On the 6 May Cape, five tc was
Speaker:at
Speaker:163,928
Speaker:and that's down 17,600 week on
Speaker:week and on the Panamax is four tc open
Speaker:interest was at
Speaker:163,647
Speaker:and that's down 17,820
Speaker:week on week. And then finally the supermax ten
Speaker:tcs was at
Speaker:76,106 which is
Speaker:also down 9480
Speaker:week on week. In addition, we saw good volume on
Speaker:the Voyage routes futures last week with
Speaker:4.85 million tons changing hands on
Speaker:c 5275 kt on
Speaker:the c three and
Speaker:765 kt on the c seven. Looks
Speaker:like a good volume week. Thank you Ben for that update and I
Speaker:look forward to hearing where we end up on our next market update from the
Speaker:dry freight market. It thank you Jess.
Speaker:Next we have Halpe senior analysts from our Shanghai office. So
Speaker:how great to have you with us. We have seen the iron ore
Speaker:index rebound from around 2.65% during the
Speaker:past report week. What caused this growth? Iron
Speaker:ore generally fell into expectation last week,
Speaker:as we mentioned in the previous cast that the correction
Speaker:would not be sustainable by that time the Epsilon
Speaker:papaya nor was rather humble compared with
Speaker:copper, oil, silver and other
Speaker:folktales global wise and brakes in
Speaker:late April the market started to trade
Speaker:risk off well against expecting temporarily
Speaker:ceasefire in mid east or Red Sea area as
Speaker:well. The US federal conference reviewed salvage
Speaker:signals during past week and what's more,
Speaker:China political
Speaker:infrastructure and housing market before the
Speaker:holiday. These are all good news. So after a
Speaker:combination of good news and compared with other high
Speaker:liquid assets, the growth on iron ore might explain the market
Speaker:was not super positive on the product. I mean just
Speaker:compared to all the rest of our asset classes. Just following the
Speaker:growth after headlines put out and digest by market,
Speaker:I think it comes out of period of
Speaker:second gas though which is the downside
Speaker:risk. All right, so
Speaker:similar question to last podcast, but do you think
Speaker:the growth this time will be sustainable? As I mentioned, downside
Speaker:risk. So I think the growth will be sustainable if we
Speaker:go back to the fundamental side, which is the margin,
Speaker:which is the low of
Speaker:the year and also a seasonal low which would
Speaker:give further limit on the production size of
Speaker:steel. That is why we can't see a traditional business
Speaker:even this year. The low margin condition lasts through
Speaker:the entire 2024 h one so
Speaker:far. On the other side, according to Lincoln
Speaker:schedules, the arrivals of iron ore would also peak
Speaker:in May. At the same time, iron ore inventories were
Speaker:at a seasonal high level. So oversupply is a basic
Speaker:tone of iron ore market in May. So in general
Speaker:iron ore is slight bearish on fundamental
Speaker:perspective and also overvalued correlate from
Speaker:my perspective. All right, well thank you so much. For that
Speaker:update Hal and now let's talk about
Speaker:fuel oil with the people's broker Archers middle. Archie, thank you
Speaker:very much for joining us again. How are you doing today? Yes, all good,
Speaker:all good. Glad to be back. The friend month, brent crude
Speaker:futures actually fell. I think it was around like six to 7%
Speaker:on the week last week. Of course. Are we still looking at some
Speaker:sort of like depleting war premium? Are there other factors to play any
Speaker:geopolitics for your international relations geek like
Speaker:myself? Yeah, for sure. I mean, it's still
Speaker:very much a decrease in the war premium that I spoke about on
Speaker:the last episode two weeks ago. To kind of follow on from that, I
Speaker:mentioned in that podcast that some analysts at Bloomberg had estimated like a
Speaker:rather extreme $25 war premium, whereas other analysts
Speaker:in the market are looking more at a kind of five to ten dollar war
Speaker:premium, which I think is slightly more realistic. And yeah, again, look, as
Speaker:ceasefire talks continue and escalation
Speaker:kind of subdues or steadies, if you will.
Speaker:There is certainly that factor of this war premium that had already been priced in
Speaker:by the market sliding. There are other factors indeed that have kind of come about
Speaker:this week that are really affecting the price as well. I mean, mid week last
Speaker:week we had the US EIA data, which
Speaker:is the data that shows the oil and products
Speaker:inventories in the US. They had a massive kind of surprise build of
Speaker:over 7 million barrels in the crude. I think estimations were well off.
Speaker:And that kind of snowballed, acted as a catalyst for the,
Speaker:for the Brent cruise. Well, it fell about 3% on the day and
Speaker:certainly snowballed into about 7% fall on the week. And that's been
Speaker:reinforced again last night by the API data
Speaker:that again showed a smaller build of crude, which is basically just kind of
Speaker:suggesting that there is kind of ample supply in the physical market, which
Speaker:again is adding that downward pressure to the future.
Speaker:Yeah, so off the back of the API data that came out last night, I
Speaker:mean, Brent's off 1% on the day already. And another thing I
Speaker:suppose, to mention is the US dollar has been getting
Speaker:stronger kind of from the middle of last week. We've seen an uptick in the
Speaker:US dollar. When the US dollar gets stronger. Holders of other currencies against
Speaker:the dollar have less buying power for crude because it all trades in dollars.
Speaker:We often see an inverse relationship there. When the US dollar strengthens, crude comes off
Speaker:because less people are buying it. Another point to mention that's definitely had a
Speaker:play yesterday or the day before when the news came out is russian
Speaker:deputy head came out with a statement saying, look,
Speaker:we are prepared to adjust oil production if
Speaker:needs must. And he was actually talking from the opposite direction that OPEC have been
Speaker:going recently. And he was basically saying if oil production needs to be increased, we
Speaker:can do it. That's not to say they have done that yet, or they will
Speaker:do that. But just a headline alone did really influence the market with that
Speaker:kind of feel of that flurry of more supply and again added that downward pressure.
Speaker:So, I mean, you know, the front branch crude futures have gone from kind of
Speaker:highs of $90 or just over $90 last month, and now we're trading
Speaker:around the $82 barrel level. So, yeah, certainly seeing some weakness in the
Speaker:market there. Okay. We will see how the story unfolds and especially like
Speaker:the whole OPEC Russia relationship continues.
Speaker:Yeah. So that's another very interesting aspect. So thank you
Speaker:very much, Arshi, for joining us today. Thank you, sir. And I wish you a
Speaker:nice day. Now, on the
Speaker:25 April FIS were down in Athens hosting a
Speaker:seminar on shipping risk management. From what we've learned, this
Speaker:seminar has been a success. But to tell us a little about it,
Speaker:we have Fiss consulting manager Hugh Taylor, who organized
Speaker:it and gave a presentation on risk management. Hugh, thank you very much
Speaker:for joining us today. Could you start by giving us maybe some background
Speaker:on why you held that conference, what it was about and how it
Speaker:went? My job is to help clients with topics such
Speaker:as shipping's admission into the EU ETS, the emissions trading
Speaker:system, and how to set up for and trade
Speaker:derivatives. More often than not, I find myself working with greek
Speaker:clients, which is perhaps no surprise, given they own about
Speaker:a quarter of the global fleet. In fact, in a list
Speaker:recently published by the EU, a list that assigns shipping companies
Speaker:to an EU country, there are over 750 companies
Speaker:assigned to Greece, which is roughly double the number of that
Speaker:of the second place country, which in fact only has so
Speaker:many companies assigned to it, as many non EU countries
Speaker:are actually registered to it because they just call there for
Speaker:their fuel. We wanted to head down there to teach some of these
Speaker:shipping companies about ways that we could help them manage some of their key
Speaker:risks, their costs of freight, fuel and carbon.
Speaker:So our CEO, John B. Opened up with a section on
Speaker:forward freight agreements, as he often does. He talked about the
Speaker:makeup and size of the FFA market yesterday, today and
Speaker:tomorrow. It was great as ever to get John's
Speaker:perspective as he's been involved with the FFA industry since the
Speaker:early days and even negotiated some of the first trades back in
Speaker:the late eighties. One striking statistic
Speaker:to come out of John's segment, which I heard many people
Speaker:repeating during the drinks afterwards, was that although Greece owns
Speaker:25% of the global fleet, it is responsible for only
Speaker:about 2% of the freight derivatives market. Well, this
Speaker:is very significant, but do you have any idea why
Speaker:that is? I think there are many reasons. I've spoken
Speaker:recently, in fact, with some of the biggest greek ship owners,
Speaker:some of the biggest shipping companies in the world that do not
Speaker:trade derivatives, and that seemingly as a principle,
Speaker:they prefer instead to use like traditional risk management methods,
Speaker:such as diversifying their fleets or
Speaker:rotating into long term time charter markets,
Speaker:which are more stable and index linked transactions.
Speaker:These are indeed effective methods to fully
Speaker:hedge. One would have to use also FFA and
Speaker:fuel derivatives. In fact, almost all our medium sized shipping
Speaker:clients outside of Greece use them extensively. One of the many
Speaker:reasons that greek companies are opposed to
Speaker:them seems to be a long running hangover from the financial
Speaker:crisis, in the fallout of which many companies lost a lot of
Speaker:money because they held OTC FFA positions with
Speaker:counterparties that went bust due to the crisis. FFA are no
Speaker:longer OTC. They're cleared on exchange. In fact, that change
Speaker:happened back then. Yet many Greeks remain
Speaker:marked by this time and refuse
Speaker:to accept the post 2009 structures which have actually come a
Speaker:long way. So going back to
Speaker:the conference, was it only about this sticking point?
Speaker:Oh no, not at all. That seemed to be a key
Speaker:topic that emerged. But actually after Jon, we had an FFA
Speaker:trader who gave us a glimpse of what it looks like from a practical
Speaker:standpoint. He talked a lot about portfolio management. We then had
Speaker:a marine fuels expert discussing many of the
Speaker:new alternative fuels that have emerged recently and their
Speaker:financial viability under the EU ETS and fuel, EU maritime.
Speaker:We then finally had moved on to the EU ETs and we
Speaker:had a talk on sort of key drivers within the EUA
Speaker:market. And we also had a representative from Greece's EU
Speaker:registry who offered practical advice and
Speaker:considerations when opening and operating an EUA
Speaker:account. Finally, I followed up with a brief
Speaker:insight into sort of risk management trading strategy across
Speaker:all three products. I also talked about how our consultancy helps
Speaker:clients get set up to trade. Okay, so like, it looked like very
Speaker:interesting, it was a very interesting conference and I guess that there were a lot
Speaker:of questions. So what kind of questions were asked by the attendees
Speaker:and what are the next points on the agenda? There were a few questions
Speaker:were asked in the actual event, but following the event, we put on a sort
Speaker:of drinks and canopies afterwards up in this nice bar on the 8th
Speaker:floor. And yet we were approached by loads of
Speaker:people, id say, particularly the younger
Speaker:greek generation, the traders. They wanted to
Speaker:learn more about a number of the topics from the day, but
Speaker:particularly, id say, hedging using options. The FFA
Speaker:options market has been growing really well in recent years, but
Speaker:options are still very underused by shipping
Speaker:players, particularly in comparison to other industries like
Speaker:aviation. In fact, in my speech I gave an example of a structured trade
Speaker:and fuel oil, which is actually a combination of options. I
Speaker:also gave a real life example of a simple year long
Speaker:simple hedge that uses an outright core strip. Anyway,
Speaker:with regards to what's next. Yeah, we're planning to get back down there to
Speaker:Athens to put on some classes on basic derivatives to answer
Speaker:some of this demand, which is great, really, because I really love greek
Speaker:salads. Yeah. So I'll be taking an evening class in Greek
Speaker:and stocking up on the. Old sun cream that seems much needed in Greece.
Speaker:Okay, thank you very much you for joining us today. Thanks Davide. Thanks
Speaker:everyone. And that's it for this week.
Speaker:Make sure to subscribe by clicking the subscribe button on wherever you get your
Speaker:podcast. Also make sure to follow us on LinkedIn or sign up to
Speaker:our app FIS live to make sure you never miss any freight and
Speaker:commodity analysis from FIS. Thanks again for joining us and see you in
Speaker:two weeks time on FIS Freight and commodity podcast. Freight up,
Speaker:freight up.


